Here's Why Gesture Controls in Your Car Are a Terrible Idea

"Garrett Davis" (GarrettDavis) 07/02/2014 at 13:58 • Filed to: None

27

91

We live in an age of rapid technological innovation. Everything around us is changing at an incredible pace. The phone in your pocket went from a handy, if a bit dumb piece of technology to being the gateway to any interaction or piece of information with anyone or anything on earth, within about a decade... and it's cheap! For as much as we like to complain about it sometimes (like OMG all the time ), we can all pretty much agree that this tech revolution is awesome and is just getting better.

Well, most of the time.

There are instances where we are stuffing new technology into every little aspect of our lives, whether it's an improvement or not. In this case, it's !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! made to solve a problem that didn't even exist in the first place. BMW, !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! , Audi, Ford, and Mercedes-Benz are all working on their own version of gesture controls for navigating around the increasingly complex world that is your automobile.

!!! UNKNOWN CONTENT TYPE !!!

I work in the tech industry and have had tons of hands on time playing with, demoing, and working with motion controls, and I am here to tell you exactly why it doesn't belong in our cars.

So far it looks like these systems will be mostly used for simple menu navigation or quick settings that people change often like changing songs or climate controls (although they also showed off some less than productive things, like playing Poker). OK, that sounds simple enough, right? Well, first let's look at the current model of doing things:

This is Ford's standard cram-into-everything-with-wheels steering wheel for the moment, more specifically from the Focus ST (which I own). From here I can:

Navigate menus (up, down, left, right, and select)

Adjust the stereo's volume

Change audio tracks

Pause/play my music

Answer and end calls

Enable voice controls

Set and adjust cruise control

All this without ever even lifting a hand from the steering wheel. The controls are conveniently placed right next to where your thumbs naturally sit, are clearly marked with easy to recognize symbols, and are well within your peripheral vision so that you can easily see as well as feel where each button is under your thumb. They even have convenient little ridges and shapes designed specifically to let you feel them out (like the home row of your keyboard), and give a satisfying click to let you know they worked. Couldn't be more simple, right?

The problem with performing simple tasks like this, but with gestures, is how unnecessary the movements are. These systems work on basic principals to prevent false positives and false negatives. This means that the sensors will be looking at a specific window of space, most likely right in front of the screen. So if you want to swipe to the side on a menu, you take your hand off the wheel and motion to the side in front of the system's cameras, and then look over to see if it worked. Did it? How cool is technology? That was like magic!

But wait, what did this accomplish that was more efficient than the existing methods? The same task could have been done from the little arrow under your thumb, or in the case of touch screens, you get to feel the screen under your finger and swipe to the side, a gesture that we're all familiar with from our phones and tablets. Now you might be thinking to yourself that I'm just a stodgy hold out for the days of the past and just need to embrace new technology, but lets try to remember what problems this is trying to solve:

1. Distracted driving — I'm not sure if you've ever used a Microsoft Kinect or a Nintento Wii, but navigating using gestures is nothing but a pain in the ass. You hover your hand over your approximation of where you think it should be, watch to make sure what you're doing is correct, and then go from there. I'm not saying that things will be this poor when operating the system in your car, but it won't be far off. The problem is that you rely completely on visual feedback to let you know that you accomplished anything. At best this means big, easily identifiable changes, and a worst it means something like an audio cue or alert to let you know you did anything.

This also means that the system would be limited to more basic interactions for the sake of simple, quick gestures. I'll go more in depth on this below.

2. Button memorization — I don't know about you, but I don't need any more than second glance after that to remember where a button is — and that's if it is outside of my peripheral vision, which is not often for common controls like this. Again, these systems are all pretty similar across platforms. Stereo controls have been in the center of your dash for decades, and it's a pretty solid guess that the climate controls will be somewhere below those, and again the signage for these controls have long since been standardized. Just have a look below and tell me you wouldn't immediately recognize these controls anywhere:

While we're talking about button memorization, how about gesture memorization? This is something that you cannot rely on visual cues to remember (unless they put big reminders everywhere, which would be annoying), unlike the symbols and words on the current controls that are immediately recognizable, allowing you to go by "I'll know it when I see it." This admittedly isn't an issue for simple navigation since that is fairly intuitive, but what happens when you start getting into more specific gestures or specific tasks?

Once I swipe through the menu, how do I select what I want? Do I hover my hand over the screen like shown above? Does that mean that the menu is simplified down to only one item on the screen at a time for me to select (like the image where he's sorting through albums), or will I have to hover specifically over the one I want? What if I hit a bump and my hand moves? Do I have to carefully swipe around the menu again because I accidentally swiped out of it?

If I want to bring up navigation, do I !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! in the air for the shape of a map?

If I want to set the HVAC to recirculate, do I make a circular motion with my hands?

Is any of this an improvement over just pushing the god damned button I want and being done with it?

Look. I'm all for technological innovation, but we have to draw the line somewhere for certain tasks. I know that gesture controls are still in the relatively early stages of development, but the biggest problem is the incredibly imprecise method of input. Humans are great at reaching out and touching or grabbing things, but hovering our arms out in the air in specific locations with nothing to brace them against is something we're just not good at — especially not when going over bumpy roads and trying to stay alert to changing traffic conditions. We're much better at controlling physical objects, or even with voice controls, which are getting better and better all the time (but still aren't great).

While it looks cool being able to manipulate your environment by just waving your hands in air like some kind of cool, non-Scientologist Tom Cruise, this just isn't the answer for our distracted driving problem.

ly2v8-Brian > Garrett Davis 07/02/2014 at 14:05

48

Not to be a Luddite, but this is dumb. Why cant I have a simple radio? Why does everything need to have a touchscreen? Why waste time on stupid shit that doesn't matter instead of focusing on making the car all about driving?

Mr. Sinister > ly2v8-Brian 07/02/2014 at 14:16

31

Appreciating simplicity does not make one a Luddite, and anyone who tries to tell you different is selling something.

ly2v8-Brian > Mr. Sinister 07/02/2014 at 14:17

2

That's why I'm looking to invest in an E30 3series.

Sethism > Garrett Davis 07/02/2014 at 14:20

1

Yet another example of marketing departments pushing shit we don't need on people who are dull and stupid enough to be fascinated by anything techy.

chrisbattle > Garrett Davis 07/02/2014 at 14:21

4

Yay, let's give people more shit to play with in the car so they don't get bored with mundane activities like piloting their 60 mph missile down a 15 foot path with only .3 seconds of reaction time before slamming into your asphalt neighbor

CrymeLord > ly2v8-Brian 07/02/2014 at 14:22

0

What are these "radios" you speak of?

Mr. Sinister > Garrett Davis 07/02/2014 at 14:23

5

We continue to add multitudes of complications to our daily lives, and wonder why stress is killing us. The first article I read about "Who should be responsible when an autonomous car gets into an accident" tells me all I need to know about the future we're creating for ourselves. If I didn't know better, I'd swear everyone is trying to circumvent personal responsibility.

I love tech. I love scientific exploration. I love that we as humans have the ability to improve our lives through our own innovation. But at some point, we need to step back and really look at which innovations improve our lives, and which make them more complicated. Progress with no direction is not progress, and innovation without positive benefit is waste.

the7thearlofgrey > ly2v8-Brian 07/02/2014 at 14:23

2

read this commoner

Highball! > Garrett Davis 07/02/2014 at 14:25

3

Gesture controls and Italians is going to be an intersting combination.

Titanius Anglesmith > Garrett Davis 07/02/2014 at 14:28

2

Plus, when I flip off the guy in front of me it's going to switch to country western music or the raps or some shit.

ly2v8-Brian > the7thearlofgrey 07/02/2014 at 14:29

2

StndIbnz > Garrett Davis 07/02/2014 at 14:31

2

I work at an automotive OEM and we had a supplier come in a few years ago with this tech in a demonstration. I hated it for exactly these reasons. Why would I want to do all these gestures when I already have a button to do it, that I can easily reach and I know where its at. These do not belong in cars at all.

Clay_T > Garrett Davis 07/02/2014 at 14:32

3

Back when I was training dogs for obedience and protection, the goal was to have the dog work off leash.

Advanced obedience training included hand signals instead of voice commands.

One day I'm walking with a friend, and my dog at heel. I'm talking to him and raise my right hand, some sort of animated gesture related to the conversation.

Wave right hand, palm up, is the sit out of motion command.

A few seconds pass and we notice the dog is missing. Look behind us and there sits Shaina, doing exactly what I 'commanded' her to do.

No1451 > ly2v8-Brian 07/02/2014 at 14:32

0

Some of us have other needs from our cars. I work in field operations which means that my office is more or less behind the wheel of my car. When I'm on a marathon 1300km drive across the Canadian Prairies those extra features come in handy

DMCVegas > ly2v8-Brian 07/02/2014 at 14:34

7

THANK YOU! THANK YOU! THANK YOU!

I have said this over and over again. I love a spartan interior with simple controls, features, and functions. I like luxuries, sure. I love my sat radio, and it's nice to have my phone go hands free through it. But in reality, please, ditch the touch screens, the sat nav, and other crap when it becomes a nuisance and takes away from my driving experience.

I have a 2014 Focus SE and can concur that when something doesn't work properly like SYNC does with many of it's advertised features (see previous rants), it kills the driving experience. Now I'm focused more on getting crap to work right rather than having a pleasant drive, and since the technology is so disappointing, it has since distracted me from enjoying my driving experience.

Give me button controls, a simple radio, and rubber floors like in my truck and I'm happy. Throw in the handsfree calling and the Satellite Radio and it's perfect. Start throwing in touch screens, and useless crap like Microsoft's daily horoscope for SYNC (an actual paid service available on Fords), and you've just killed the whole thing as far as I'm concerned.

Keep it simple!

Mash_Tun > Garrett Davis 07/02/2014 at 14:35

3

Controls in vehicles (of any sort, really) should, ideally, be tactile and easy to locate for the very simple reason that you should be LOOKING AT THE FUCKING ROAD, goddammit.

I want to sit down in the drivers seat, close my eyes, and be able to locate, decipher, and operate any control purely by feel. You can tell when a switch is switched, or a knob is turned, or a button is depressed, but you have to stop, read, navigate a menu and aim a finger at a touchscreen.

Manufacturers are so caught up with cashing in on fads, and catering to people's ever-shortening attention spans with new technologies, that they are failing to stop and ask if any of them are appropriate...or even SAFE. There are better ways to incorporate tech but figuring them out takes time and money, and such is the state of business that they're more interested in doing it quickly rather than appropriately.

nmalinoski > Garrett Davis 07/02/2014 at 14:37

2

There are instances where we are stuffing new technology into every little aspect of our lives, whether it's an improvement or not.

You mean infotainment, right?

colorfulyawn > Garrett Davis 07/02/2014 at 14:37

5

Exactly.

Technology needs to be applied appropriately. For example, I'm not in love with touch screens, but when it comes to my smartphone, I recognize that they are the best technology for maximizing the functionality of a device that has to do a lot of shit and still fit in my pocket. I wouldn't want to even try to build a smartphone with all button controls, because it would suck.

But my car is not a smartphone, or a tablet. It has an entirely different set of priorities, an entirely different way to be used. There is room for an interface comprised of unique-function buttons and rotary knobs, and anything I'm trying to use needs to be accessible via muscle memory and provide tactile feedback. That is the appropriate technology for interfacing with cars, and gesture controls are like the 180-degree opposite of that.

CleverUsername > ly2v8-Brian 07/02/2014 at 14:41

1

I may have a 1991 325i sedan for sale soon.......

Drakkon- Most Glorious and Upright Person of Genius > Garrett Davis 07/02/2014 at 14:42

0

Speed indicator!

BigDave23 > Garrett Davis 07/02/2014 at 14:42

4

Complexity does not equal sophistication.

nmalinoski > Garrett Davis 07/02/2014 at 14:43

0

It's a good thing I don't go to these shows. Something like this would make me want to projectile vomit all over their display.

Garrett Davis > nmalinoski 07/02/2014 at 14:44

0

I originally had a few paragraphs dedicated to that very thing, but I cut it to stay on topic. Don't get me started on the wretched word that is infotainment.

nmalinoski > No1451 07/02/2014 at 14:45

0

Sounds like you need a Johnny Taxi.

Ark > ly2v8-Brian 07/02/2014 at 14:45

2

Money. Fancy options pump up sticker prices which pumps up profit margins. Also, most people hate driving, are shitty at driving, and are desperate for any toys and gizmos to distract them from having to drive.

Drakkon- Most Glorious and Upright Person of Genius > Garrett Davis 07/02/2014 at 14:45

0

We didn't buy it, but we drove the Ford Flex. This was a 2013 model so it's the newest version of their in-car system. It was pretty intuitive and one thing I liked was the four different areas of interest were different colors: radio, nav, HVAC and (some other) screen were red yellow blue green. The best part was the same colors appeared in the instruments right in front of you so you could navigate the easy stuff on the menu right there between the gauges.

none8239487234 > Garrett Davis 07/02/2014 at 14:47

1

Why are the car makers doing all of this? Cost of course. Software is cheaper than hardware. If they can reduce the sheer number of switches and buttons in a car they can reduce the cost it takes to produce one. And at the same time making you "think" you are getting some cutting edge technology. They will continue to push this technology because it's profitable for them regardless if it actually enhances driving or makes people safer. Moving all of their cars to touch screens and gesture controls is a natural step for them. For many years the computers have already been there. They are just adding bad interfaces to save some money. And of course stupid consumers that don't know any better all eat this stuff up.

Personally I can't stand cars like this and refuse to buy one. Not a single one of my cars has a tacky touch screen in the dash and I plan on keeping it that way.

Garrett Davis > Clay_T 07/02/2014 at 14:48

3

And I have a feeling that Shaina is a whole lot smarter than any system like this we'll be seeing in the near future.

Garrett Davis > BigDave23 07/02/2014 at 14:48

1

That's an excellent way of putting it.

nmalinoski > Garrett Davis 07/02/2014 at 14:49

1

Start! Start! You could always expand on infotainment in a new article.

CobraJoe > Garrett Davis 07/02/2014 at 14:50

1

I understand the idea, to free up space for more screen or styling, and then keep all the necessary controls possible to use while not looking at buttons or screens or whatever.

But I also can see how this would easily get out of hand (pun unintended) without some standardization. Does moving your hand up increase volume or fan speed or only menu navigation?

Garrett Davis > nmalinoski 07/02/2014 at 14:50

0

I think it's a few years too late for that, but at the pace they keep adding these "enhancements" I should have plenty of material for one soon.

Garrett Davis > Drakkon- Most Glorious and Upright Person of Genius 07/02/2014 at 14:51

1

That's the one good thing about Ford's MyTouch. It's a fairly well laid out system for most tasks.

ly2v8-Brian > Ark 07/02/2014 at 14:53

0

There are cars for those people, they are called Camry

Paullubbock > Garrett Davis 07/02/2014 at 14:53

2

I totally agree. Gesture control is completely not the way to go Especially in an automobile. An example, I purchased a nifty device called the Leap Motion hand gesture controller for my laptop. The device is a motion based sensor that very intelligently and accurately captures the motion of your hands down to individual digits to control your computer. In theory it was wow, this is going to be great. In practice, it was very difficult to consistently have your finger, hand in exactly the correct location to equal the functions of a simple mouse. Peoples hands are just not designed to be held in the air and perform exact motions. It was great in theory but a complete failure in reality. Add to that the distraction of driving and the bouncing around of the road and it is just stupid and dangerous.

tromoly > No1451 07/02/2014 at 15:04

0

So driving 1300km doesn't give you enough rest stops to do whatever office business you need to do? I guess I fail to see how that can be safe.

Nibbles > Garrett Davis 07/02/2014 at 15:05

4

Just remember where this all started:

Garrett Davis > Nibbles 07/02/2014 at 15:06

1

No1451 > tromoly 07/02/2014 at 15:11

0

...No it means that this "just give us a basic radio!" stuff isn't practical. Things like answering calls, having some basic nav are little tidbits of comfort to make things go more easily. It doesn't need to do everything, nor should it, but just stubbornly sticking to current input methods is backwards and silly.

No1451 > nmalinoski 07/02/2014 at 15:12

0

Autonomous car would be amazing, I could get driven where I need to be and not still have hours of deskwork to complete afterwards. Win win

Atomic Buffalo > Garrett Davis 07/02/2014 at 15:22

1

Great piece, Garrett.

Buttons work. Controls that require visual location and confirmation every time suck, no matter how easy it might be to add new functions or deeper layers or leverage a single cheap input device. Automakers need to stop trying to cater to the "soft interfaces everywhere!" mentality — people who want that are the reason we have cell phone bans and other distracted driving laws.

Buttons require fixed hardware? THAT'S THE POINT, guys.

Adam J. Stevens > Garrett Davis 07/02/2014 at 15:22

0

Start working at home with Google! It's by-far the best job I've had. Last Wednesday I got a brand new BMW since getting a check for $6474 this - 4 weeks past. I began this 8-months ago and immediately was bringing home at least $77 per hour. I work through this link, go to tech tab for work detail http://w­­­ww.jobs700.com

Adam J. Stevens > Garrett Davis 07/02/2014 at 15:22

0

Start working at home with Google! It's by-far the best job I've had. Last Wednesday I got a brand new BMW since getting a check for $6474 this - 4 weeks past. I began this 8-months ago and immediately was bringing home at least $77 per hour. I work through this link, go to tech tab for work detail http://w­­­ww.jobs700.com

jedre > Garrett Davis 07/02/2014 at 15:30

1

Very well written.

The lack of tactile feedback (even with touchscreens) is a massive step backward, in and of itself.

A simple Task Analysis should reveal that this UI is slower than a 1980s button array.

And eventually, my f@cking arm is going to get tired of flapping all over like a drunk chicken.

plainnottoasted > Garrett Davis 07/02/2014 at 15:30

1

A couple of weeks ago I watched a driver animatedly talking using both hands to gesticulate wildly while driving. She was alone, talking at her sync or some bs.

>>redacted<< idiot.

brandondrums > Garrett Davis 07/02/2014 at 15:31

3

jedre > BigDave23 07/02/2014 at 15:31

2

Well said. And when it comes to UI - usually it's the opposite of sophistication.

Garrett Davis > brandondrums 07/02/2014 at 15:34

0

Perfect.

Garrett Davis > jedre 07/02/2014 at 15:36

1

Thank you! Very true. This is why the whole Minority Report gesture UI is just completely impractical for anything but looking cool. We have a giant touch screen in the lobby of our building running Angry Birds, and doing anything on it is just a hassle and gets old very quickly.

tromoly > No1451 07/02/2014 at 15:37

1

Ok, that makes sense, but I think you missed the point of the OP's comment. GPS? That's fine, that's something you really don't mess with while driving, so use your touchscreen display for that. Answering calls? IIRC Ford has a button on the steering wheel to deal with that, that method is perfectly fine. Control the radio with a touchscreen? Nope, changing commonly-adjusted things with a touch screen while driving is bad news.

So TL;DR, keep touchscreens for lesser-adjusted items, keep buttons for radio/climate control/more commonly adjusted items.

Garrett Davis > Atomic Buffalo 07/02/2014 at 15:38

0

Thank you!

Great points. I totally forgot the whole cell phone ban aspect. I don't see the massive difference between operating your phone on a stand on your dash and using the built in, slow and more complicated UI. It just doesn't make sense.

brandondrums > Garrett Davis 07/02/2014 at 15:39

1

Thanks. BTW, if you ever end up working on ergonomics for cars, hire a designer for the visually impaired as a consultant. You'll end up running the company and changing the automotive industry.

However, I actually think Ferrari does this already...one of the few.

Tt3Sheppard > Garrett Davis 07/02/2014 at 15:41

2

I'll take my clunky knobs and 1980's clock thanks

Garrett Davis > brandondrums 07/02/2014 at 15:42

0

Interesting. Not something a whole lot of people consider.

Garrett Davis > Tt3Sheppard 07/02/2014 at 15:44

1

For as "pedestrian" as it has become, you really can't beat the three dial system for practicality. It wouldn't be easier to use.

Atomic Buffalo > Garrett Davis 07/02/2014 at 15:44

1

Even if they make the car faster and more consistent than the smartphone, the basic interface is wrong-headed. Millions of people trying to make it work do not make it a good idea. Eyes on the road!

No1451 > tromoly 07/02/2014 at 15:44

0

He says to make it all about driving and that he just wants a "simple radio". That does not indicate a GPS or any of the bells and whistles.

Mostly I just wish people would stop holding up current vehicle setups as the ideal system when it's really really poorly done. Gesture control is a fucking stupid idea(stupid stupid stupid) but that doesn't mean physical buttons are the way to go. Voice control seems like the obvious course to take, it's what I use right now when driving with a passenger. Yelling at my passenger to change the damn station is basically voice control...right?

tromoly > No1451 07/02/2014 at 15:47

0

To each their own. Personally my favorite vehicle was one where there no entertainment system of any kind, only a Radio Delete Plate in the dash to cover the hole where a radio would have sit. Granted the longest drive I did in that car was about 2 hours, but it was the most fun vehicle to drive.

Lemonhead > Garrett Davis 07/02/2014 at 16:03

1

I have the FIOS app for my phone. Because I have no button, the only way I know what I'm pressing is to look at the remote. So, to scan through channels, I have to look at the TV, then down at the phone, push the up or down button, look back at the TV, look down at the phone, push the up or down button, lather, rinse, repeat.

With the standard remote, I can feel where my thumb is on the remote and I can concentrate on the screen.

With touchscreen interfaces on cars, I am worried about the distracted nature. The Tesla has a huge, 17" monitor for all it's controls, and while it's beautiful, you have to look at the screen to know what you are touching.

I think voice control is a better solution - even if it's not quite there yet.

Garrett Davis > Lemonhead 07/02/2014 at 16:04

1

Great example of more "innovation" that doesn't really solve a problem.

dr861 > Garrett Davis 07/02/2014 at 16:13

1

This needed to be said. Hit it on the nose.

J "oppo" Zeke > Garrett Davis 07/02/2014 at 16:15

1

Having been designing user-interfaces in cars/trucks/boats/tractors and more over the last 8 years, I've heard every reason why go tech and why not.

I'll put it out there, as a designer - the guy who actually comes up with the ideas and sells those who are willing to listen what I think is best - there's only so far we can go in interiors before we have to hand control of the car over to robots.

Gestures? Yea I've seen these and talked about these years for a few years now, and I too agree they aren't a great idea for cars. At least not ones you, you know... drive.

The problem isn't the tech, it's the driver. When I watch the full range of driver attitudes on a normal day, from indifference to scary psychotic I ask myself, do I really want to make this knife edge of a situation any worse? Are the little bleach-haired plastic chicks with the expensive sunglasses really capable of manipulating that ML350 AND a gesture? Is homie laid back/riding low/riding dirty in that least 650ci competent to handle any more car? Does broham from Naperville in his Sonata with two sports-hero-in-training kiddies in the backseat really need another distraction?

Short answer: F**K NO

I was talking with my partner last night, whilst enjoying my old BMW on Lakeshore drive about the day's psychos I had witnessed, and he said "none of this would be a problem if everyone had to drive stick." Really, that's what it boils down to. If drivers in America at least didn't have that hand free, would automakers be trying to cram in new technologies to make sales in the showroom?

I think not.

Caveat however: Touchpads that use gestures are already in use in premium cars. Perhaps a gesture universe CAN work if it is limited to one common place (in this case the top of the ring encoders for controlling screens) on ALL cars. Commonality can lead to universal understanding and better education in controls.

Lemonhead > Garrett Davis 07/02/2014 at 16:15

1

The only problem it solves is I can turn off the kids TV in the other room when they ignore me telling them to go to bed.

That feature is AWESOME!

Garrett Davis > dr861 07/02/2014 at 16:22

0

Thank you!

Garrett Davis > J "oppo" Zeke 07/02/2014 at 16:37

0

Agreed 100%. Interesting to get a designer's viewpoint here, thanks!

Matthew A. Coleman > Garrett Davis 07/02/2014 at 17:08

0

my best friend's aunt makes $86 /hour on the internet . She has been unemployed for 7 months but last month her paycheck was $21100 just working on the internet for a few hours. navigate to this website  WWW.JOBSSEND.COM

Time is a flat circle > Garrett Davis 07/02/2014 at 17:24

1

If you're waving your arms around while driving, I fear the car will follow and you'll be weaving all over the road

PNW20v > Garrett Davis 07/02/2014 at 17:24

1

And the S-class Merc guys thought it was bad when they had to replace the entertainment system.... This will be hell

nmalinoski > No1451 07/02/2014 at 18:23

0

I don't completely agree with you on the practicality argument. The safest thing to do is have someone with you to field calls/texts/emails while you drive (Aka, the Buddy System), or stop periodically so you can address them yourself (Which you should do anyway on long trips to stretch your legs); my point being that driving is something you should not divert your attention from, say, to fiddle with a phone.

If your work requires you to field calls and emails while you're driving to a client location, your employer is putting you at risk of serious injury, and itself at risk of a lawsuit.

No1451 > nmalinoski 07/02/2014 at 18:43

0

Self driving is the way to go eventually, so that people CAN use travel time productively. Voice control though for standard car functions that you wouldn't want directly on the wheel would be great. If it use data that would be a deal breaker though as I'm often "off the grid" because Saskatchewan sucks.

The employer always insists that we be safe. I've gotten a bit of flak for my less than exemplary safety focus when driving.

Pitchblende > Garrett Davis 07/02/2014 at 19:11

1

I just wonder what it will interpret the universal gesture for "there's a bee in the car" as.

cspak71 > ly2v8-Brian 07/02/2014 at 19:40

1

Agreed, people don't realize that the simplest and easiest ways to do things are the most analog. I could probably change the volume on a car stereo with a traditional circular knob vs. the touchscreen controls that many companies are trying to push onto me. This is where technology isn't necessarily making things more ergonomic. My fingers can recognize a knob vs. a button, where a touchscreen, it's all flat and the same and makes me take my eyes off the road.

Aliens Ate My Buick > Garrett Davis 07/02/2014 at 19:56

0

This immediately came to mind.....

wiffleballtony > Garrett Davis 07/02/2014 at 20:09

0

I'm assuming the middle finger operates the horn.

Maxaxle > Garrett Davis 07/02/2014 at 22:22

0

Incidentally, the video-playing thing from Minority Report was shown fast-forwarding a lot when the main character went to shake someone's hand.

ly2v8-Brian > cspak71 07/02/2014 at 23:04

0

THIS

yuriinfo > Garrett Davis 07/02/2014 at 23:39

0

YEAH! Gesture all the things!

qiezi for lunch > Garrett Davis 07/03/2014 at 00:53

0

Heres why gesture control in your car is a damn good idea

OK, first I gotta admit that the way it is now, controlling a screen by gestures is utter nonsens and I agree with everything you said. When using controls you want something to be changed or adjusted, so you want to have to do as few steps as possible to get there. Take a Gesture controlled screen:

Hand off steering wheel - (put hand in front of screen and) do gesture - check screen - do select/confirm gesture - check screen for confirmation (multiply last four steps by amount of menues you go through) - hand back to steering wheel .

Compared to a simple physical button: Hand off steering wheel - look for button - push putton - hand back to steering wheel. DONE

Or even better, buttons on the steering wheel: push button . One single simple step, perfect!

That way Gestures increas the amount of steps by at least three, if not more. Makes no sense, I agree.

But lets just look at simple, often fullfilled tasks that cant be controlled by steering wheel buttons (these definitely cant be optimized any further), for example climate controls and cut that stupid screen out of the gesture controlling process - noone needs a screen for doing gestures.

With specific gestures replacing the buttons your action is : hand off steering wheel - look for button - push button - do gesture - hand back to steering wheel . And as this technology is probably being offered in top of the range models with HUDs first, you could simply have a small icon flashing up on the HUD to confirm any action or gesture.

This way, you wouldnt have to take your eyes off the street at all.

Garrett Davis > qiezi for lunch 07/03/2014 at 01:37

0

I don't know what car you drive, but most any car I've driven, I don't have to look around to find the climate controls every time I drive. Most of the time they're in your peripheral vision, and just a short reach beyond the shifter where you can feel the dial or button in question, and manipulate it from there. It takes no more than a glance or two to get a good feel for where these commonly used controls are, and then you can reach out for them easily without taking your eyes off the road.

Plus, instead of button locations, you'll have to remember what gesture does what. Does motioning upwards turn up the temperature or does it turn up the fan? Are there separate and more complex gestures I need to remember for the A/C, heater, recirculate, defrost, directing to feet, and heated seats? Will there be a visual guide up at all times to remind you of what the different gestures are? Like I said, even if I forget where a button that I don't use often is, I can still glance down and immediately find the symbol for it.

Remember, the more gestures there are, there is also more room for error as the computer has to look for more specific movements than if there were fewer — and if there are only very few gestures, is that really worth it over just committing the button locations to muscle memory?

Is the entire gesture system just for the HVAC? Are you really adjusting that enough that it becomes a real distraction to change those settings?

If the gestures are simple, then there need to be specific rules the sensors follow to prevent false positives and negatives, because both are very frustrating. Maybe you need to make the gesture within a few inches of the screen, and if I hold my hand too far back, will it ignore my actions? How easy will it be for the computer to decipher whether I'm just having an emotive conversation, reaching for a drink, or motioning for another driver to go? There is only a very limited space for this sensors to interact with, partially because there is limited space in the cabin, and partially because it needs a movement exclusive environment to operate in.

I still just don't see the utility here. You pretty much can't beat the three dial system:

One adjusts the fan speed, one tells the fan where to blow, and the other controls the temperature. This is an extremely common set up, and with such big and easy to recognize symbols, it's very easy to remember what each dial does and allow yourself to operate them from your peripheral vision as well as muscle memory. Hell, often times I find myself adjusting the knobs while looking out the window to watch for cars passing.

Sorry, I just can't think of a situation that this improves.

qiezi for lunch > Garrett Davis 07/03/2014 at 02:38

0

Im DDing my bicycle, the climate controls therefore are somewhere in my wardrobe.

But when doing longer distances, its a W212. That one doesnt have that three dial system but a line of buttons on the very bottom of the centre console, hard to reach behind the gearshifter with buttons that all look the same.

You would have to remember the gestures, but you also managed to remember them on your phone, tablet and laptop. Now dont tell me there arent at least a few gestures youd never want to miss again. I think its possible to have a lot of smart gestures that are easily memorizable, using different amounts of fingers for example.

The computers recognition has to be just as good as pushing a button: without any errors. But thats possible.

You would need an area for the gestures, i wouldnt like that to be in front of the screen either because lifting your hand sucks. What about the area right above the (iDrive) wheel? Thats close to the shifter (where I hope your hand is on most of the time) and dedicated to controlls anyway. Or have a "gesture"-button on the wheel to activate the sensors while being pushed. There should be many areas and ways to get rid of random movements being recognized as gestures.

Replacing formerly button controlled actions would be a nice gizmo IMO, that compared to the application described in the article could improve the usability, even just by a little.

Reading your comment and thinking about this a little more, I think gestures would realy kick in as soon as they replace an action that formerly required looking at the infotainment screen or worse, touching it. I cant think of any right now but Im sure there are a lot of people involved in interior-development that could invent such. Because after all, these infotainment systems (especially those huge touchscreen-only-center consoles) are as awful as their name and the worst thing that happened to automobiles in a long long time. I prefere buttons over screens, but some features simply cant be dealt with with buttons alone, so I think this is where gestures could help along.

Hell, imagine getting rid of that terrible screen in the middle of your car without loosing its features!!

BiffMagnetude > Garrett Davis 07/03/2014 at 09:26

0

"Look. I'm all for technological innovation, but we have to draw the line somewhere for certain tasks."

No we don't. While I currently hate voice recognition and prefer old fashioned buttons and knobs to touch screens, there is never going to be a breakthrough or improvement over what exists if engineers surrender to the concept of drawing the line. There never, ever should be a line.

So far nobody has defeated the simple volume knob as an excellent control, that does not mean they never will. Limits must be pushed or sameness will reign. If you presented the same argument about forced induction or variable valve timing, the guys who support this post would proclaim that you were nuts.

I too think gestures seem like a dumb idea, but I would love to have some smart designer prove me wrong.

Garrett Davis > BiffMagnetude 07/03/2014 at 11:35

0

I didn't say stifle innovation period, I said "for certain tasks." That would kind be bad news for my job as an engineer. Of course I'm not saying to stop all R&D for gesture controls because they aren't 100% awesome yet, that would be stupid. I'm just saying that just because we have a technology doesn't mean it's a good idea to use it in certain areas yet. I guess should have said something more along the lines of:

"I'm all for technological innovation, but we have to draw the line at its implementation sometimes. Gesture controls will have their place, but right now they aren't the answer for distracted driving."

Better?

BiffMagnetude > Garrett Davis 07/03/2014 at 11:54

0

No.

There should never be a line you can't cross. As long as manufacturers include redundant more traditional controls there's nothing to complain about. If the gesture experiment fails, that's fine.

Limits are lame. There is no way to know what is possible without making the attempt and getting the technology into the hands of the public.

Garrett Davis > BiffMagnetude 07/03/2014 at 12:58

0

*sigh*

Ok, then maybe I should have said:

"I'm all for technological innovation, but we have to draw the line at its implementation sometimes. Gesture controls will have their place, but right now they aren't the answer for distracted driving. As long as we still have our easy to use and more efficient hardware controls as a redundancy, the market can decide the future of these features."

Emphasis on the bold, and super mega emphasis on the bold/italicized. If I meant halt all R&D on this specific technology, the words "will" and "right now" would not have been included in that sentence.

I agree with you that there should never be a limit placed, I didn't mean that to be taken as an overall rule. I agree that they can put them in as many products as they please, but that doesn't mean it's a good solution. An example of this done wrong is with something like the Nintendo Wii, where they forced the user to use gesture controls for many basic functions and limited any other method of getting things done. I would like to think that others would not do something similar, but that would be underestimating the power of marketing.

I'm a very firm believer in letting the market decide, anything I said was not meant as a hard limit that shouldn't be breached. I almost feel like we're arguing semantics here, and that the caveats should be implied, but I guess I didn't provide enough background on where I come from on this. I mentioned it in another thread, but I work in this industry and more specifically for one of the major players in this exact market. No one's trying to stifle innovation here, least of which me. I think I'm just doing a terrible job at conveying this.

BiffMagnetude > Garrett Davis 07/06/2014 at 09:23

0

We are definitely arguing semantics to a degree. But respectfully arguing the nuanced edges of a concept is a lot more fun than a flame war (which too can be fun).

There is no way to know whether gestures will have their place because we have no idea if that will occur. They may be tried, tried again until they are invalidated. We won't know until we know and we can't know until we try. Again, lose the line and keep your mind open. Gestures could be a monumental flop and that's ok. The knob may prevail as a monumental achievement in automotive system control for the rest of our lives. That would be fine, but in the meantime, we need to promote not deny or dissuade attempts to find something better.

Never disregard a hypothesis before it has been tested, tested again and tested some more.

The real problem is, you need to create hits and "Gestures for car control technology is immature not necessarily the cure for distracted driving and may or may not be very useful for several generations." Is not exactly a firm stance that will inspire conversation.

I think it would have been more fun if you had gone all in with "Gestures Will Destroy Knobs In The Next Three Months." It would have been pretty hard to support that thesis, but you could do it and you'd inspire more hate mail than the last two presidents combined.

Jacob > Garrett Davis 07/10/2014 at 23:47

0

A million times over, YES.

Technology is supposed to solve a problem or make something easier, or more elegant to accomplish. In some cases give us an entirely new ability..

But lately it seems people are running out of things to solve, so they are just shoving trendy tech into things without analyzing whether or not it actually does any of these things:

1) Make something easier

2) Make something faster

3) Make something more functional, or enable something previously impossible or impractical.

If it doesn't actually fit at least 2 of the 3, its a waste of time and doesn't solve the problem.

Jacob > ly2v8-Brian 07/10/2014 at 23:59

0

I would much rather have touchscreen reserved for GPS and non demanding bonuses like clocks, weather, or info about a currently playing song.

For anything that actually needs to be used, even semi frequently, give me real tactile controls and simple toggles.

ly2v8-Brian > Jacob 07/10/2014 at 23:59

0

fair enough.

Jacob > No1451 07/11/2014 at 00:03

0

And most of the time for ordinary daily commuters, they just get in the way or were a total waste of money.

Strongbeard > Garrett Davis 01/08/2016 at 19:11

0

I honestly could not have put it better myself. I’m a huge tech geek. I have been since I understood electricity made pong work on the B/W TV we had in the kitchen.

I was blown away when the first iPhone came out and I knew it would change the landscape in many ways from it’s inception onward.

I currently own a 2014 ST and I even like the Sync system. It works well for me, it’s responsive and I can reasonably use it on the freeway without fear of death, but even then, I hardly use it. It is almost exclusively on the entertainment display. I rarely have to use the nav even though I consider it to be a decent one. Hell, even the voice commands work well for me but I’ll be honest, I hardly use them. The only command I ever use is “call so and so” and that’s about it.

I also picked up a 2015 base model EB Mustang this past summer. It has the bare minimums and no touch screen. I was sort of bummed for a minute until I started using the physical buttons the Mustang has and sort of had a reawakening. It was so much easier to use than all my tech-laden cars I have owned including the ST. Even the base model still has bluetooth, steering controls and hands free voice commands.

The bigger screen is nice for nav and music selection but what Ford did in the base EB suits me just fine. I no longer worry if the car has enough tech. Does it have bluetooth for music and hands free calling? Done deal. I’ve finally realized that is all I need.

Do I think the gesture tech is cool? Sure. Do I want it in a car? Hell. No. I don’t think these will work well basically ever. I think this is the most dangerous “innovation” to come from the auto industry in my life time.

I think back to how much I couldn’t use my xbox (one or 360) with the Kinnect and that was with a perfect working area, no distractions and no movement other than my body. We will just have to skip gesture controls and go straight to wireless brain controls.

Rico > Garrett Davis 01/08/2016 at 22:40

1

I agree with all of it, too much of a distraction. The touchpads on the steering wheel MB is implenting on the new E I think is the better way to go.